Doom 1 or 2?

[magicsofa]

Well thanks for reminding me of my embarrassing posts from 12 years ago, I guess...

[FourLoko Salad]

Both are near and dear to my heart, but I just finished a playthrough of both games last month on my school laptop (both Chocolate Doom, keyboard only, UV). I've heard people joke that the best levels of Doom are usually near the start of the game, with the levels starting to drag on after the halfway point, but holy shit Doom 2 really goes on for too long for my taste. Especially having to play Monster Condo and getting ghost barons spawning because I didn't kill the arch-vile in time, or getting lost in The Spirit World and running in circles for a half an hour before realizing that I have to shoot an unmarked texture in order to leave.

 

It might be because I played both games back to back, but after that point I was REALLY eager to just rush through and beat the game.

 

Doom 1: Perfect for singleplayer and co-op

Doom 2: Perfect for modding and deathmatch

[MemeMind]

Doom RPG is better tbh

[Biz!]

This thread is a real time machine.

 

Ultimate Doom of course, They Flesh Consumed was the Plutonia before Plutonia, and we all think Plutonia made us good, or better, or encouraged to be better.

[nathanB404]

for me the ssg changes everything and i cant do without it. so doom 2 gets the dub on this one

[Nefelibeta]

 

Hello from 2000

[nathanB404]

12 minutes ago, Nefelibeta said:

 

Hello from 2000

damn before i was even born 💀💀

[Gez]

Doom II should be seen as an iteration of Doom 1. It's Doom 1, but improved; with a richer gameplay and more experience in level design.

 

Which means that if you take it into the historic context of when they were released, Doom 1 was qualitatively much better than anything else available in the genre. While Doom II was only marginally better than Doom 1. Doom II was better, but didn't make as much of a splash. That's why some game magazines actually rated it lower than Doom 1, on the assumption that you already had Doom 1 so Doom II was not bringing you all that much more.

 

Anyways I'm gonna be ultra-controversial and claim that, actually, doom_complete.pk3 is the superior IWAD.

Edited January 17, 2023 by Gez

[nathanB404]

On 11/17/2022 at 12:21 PM, openxt said:

This thread is a real time machine.

 

Ultimate Doom of course, They Flesh Consumed was the Plutonia before Plutonia, and we all think Plutonia made us good, or better, or encouraged to be better.

frfr im trippin so hard rn. i swear i made a post like this today and found me self in a post that was made almost 23 years ago. 

[Nefelibeta]

38 minutes ago, nathanB404 said:

frfr im trippin so hard rn. i swear i made a post like this today and found me self in a post that was made almost 23 years ago. 

Supposedly an admin combined your thread into the giga-thread, you're a part of the time capsule now.

[Mr Masker]

Bruh they were playing doom on black and white projectors when this thread was made.

 

Also, Doom 1 for level consistency, Doom 2 for weapons and enemy variety. You can find the best of both worlds in plenty of well made Doom 2 wads.

Edited January 17, 2023 by Mr Masker

[St. Mildly Annoyed]

I'm guessing nobody will respond, but Doom II certainly had worse mapping and episodes.

[Individualised]

2 minutes ago, St. Mildly Annoyed said:

I'm guessing nobody will respond, but Doom II certainly had worse mapping and episodes.

As in the episode themes? I think they're good.

[TheEyeOfStone]

I voted for DOOM II.

Overall, I feel the levels were better in DOOM, though there were plenty of awesome levels in DOOM II.

But I went with DOOM II because I also feel that without all the different and new monster species that DOOM II adds, that DOOM would have had far less staying power for all these years than it has had.

I say less staying power, I do not say none, but I feel that the monsters added by DOOM II really brings id Software's original idea to its full fruition.

[St. Mildly Annoyed]

4 hours ago, Individualised said:

As in the episode themes? I think they're good.

Sorry, I meant the map's display of those themes, specifically the first two episodes.

Edited April 18, 2023 by St. Mildly Annoyed
Grammar mistake

[_bruce_]

8 hours ago, St. Mildly Annoyed said:

I'm guessing nobody will respond, but Doom II certainly had worse mapping and episodes.

 

The original Doom largely lives off Episode1's eternal magic.

In hindsight the rest of the mapset is, besides some nuggets(e.g. E2M2, E2M4, E3M6), rather weak.

[msx2plus]

On 9/3/2000 at 7:06 PM, Guest Mariner said:

I Wish Doom I Had A Cool Gun Like Fists Of Baron

ok so has anybody made "Fists Of Baron" yet or what, its been 23 years

[D0M0]

It was Doom II that introduced the almighty boom-stick, one of my go-to weapons. Gotta give the vote to Doom II.

Ultimate Doom was slightly tedious the first episode or two having to pretty much chaingun and shotgun about 95% of monsters.

(Especially the barons at the end when you're pistol starting each map.)

 

Spoiler

I did not expect the poll to be this close!

[BeachThunder]

As games unto themselves, I'd say Doom 1 is definitely the better of the two. It feels tightly designed and much more cohesive & consistent. Personally, I'd say Episode 4 is the weakest part, but you can also ignore it if you wanna just talk about the games as they were on initial release.

 

In an objective sense, yeah, sure, Doom II has a lot more stuff, but it also has a lot more bullshit - particularly the later levels.

I don't think there's a single bad Doom 1 level - there's absolutely some weak levels, but nothing that I actively dislike. Doom II, on the other hand, has at least two levels that I really just do not care for.

 

Firstly, The Chasm is just annoying. The whole tightrope gimmick is plain bad. No, Doom II, I do not want to walk along a whole bunch of 8-pixel-wide floors, thank you very much.

 

Also, Downtown's pretty bleuughhh. Not only do I not enjoy the city block concept, it's also equally unenjoyable from a gameplay perspective - particularly having fireballs shot at you from a bunch of random windows & ledges in some distant buildings.

 

Anyway, having said all that, Doom II is still great (easily one of the best shooters of the 90s), it's just no Doom 1. In Doom II's favour though, I will say that MAP01 > E1M1.

[enigma101]

Doom II definitely. I'm probably a bit biased as I have more nostalgia from Doom II than Ultimate Doom, but I feel like the levels are a bit more ambitious. Also, I really like the SSG. Pain Elementals and Downtown are terrible though.

[Kor]

50 minutes ago, BeachThunder said:

As games unto themselves, I'd say Doom 1 is definitely the better of the two. It feels tightly designed and much more cohesive & consistent. Personally, I'd say Episode 4 is the weakest part, but you can also ignore it if you wanna just talk about the games as they were on initial release.

 

In an objective sense, yeah, sure, Doom II has a lot more stuff, but it also has a lot more bullshit - particularly the later levels.

I don't think there's a single bad Doom 1 level - there's absolutely some weak levels, but nothing that I actively dislike. Doom II, on the other hand, has at least two levels that I really just do not care for.

 

Firstly, The Chasm is just annoying. The whole tightrope gimmick is plain bad. No, Doom II, I do not want to walk along a whole bunch of 8-pixel-wide floors, thank you very much.

 

Also, Downtown's pretty bleuughhh. Not only do I not enjoy the city block concept, it's also equally unenjoyable from a gameplay perspective - particularly having fireballs shot at you from a bunch of random windows & ledges in some distant buildings.

 

Anyway, having said all that, Doom II is still great (easily one of the best shooters of the 90s), it's just no Doom 1. In Doom II's favour though, I will say that MAP01 > E1M1.

 

I'd agree with that. Whenever I play through Doom 1, I get through it over the course of two or three days. Whereas Doom 2, I get through over the course of a couple weeks. But after E3M4, I don't really care for episode 3. And as far as PWADs go, I play more Doom 2 than Doom 1. And as far as mapping goes, I now like to do it for Doom 2 only, even though most of my work is for Doom 1.

Edited April 18, 2023 by Kor

[PKr]

You know, I was thinking...

Spoiler

The biggest advantage of Doom 1 over Doom 2 for me is the fact that... Doom 1 has episodes that can be selected on a game start! Seriously, that's a killer feature. As ridiculously as it may sound it's the root reason why I have played Doom 1 iwad so much more compared to Doom 2 over the course of my life. I might not like Doom 2's city levels, but man, if I could select Doom 2's episodes on a game start that would've been a game changer. Not kidding. I can't even explain why it's such a big deal for me.

[TheDanMarine]

1 hour ago, PKr said:

You know, I was thinking...

  Hide contents

The biggest advantage of Doom 1 over Doom 2 for me is the fact that... Doom 1 has episodes that can be selected on a game start! Seriously, that's a killer feature. As ridiculously as it may sound it's the root reason why I have played Doom 1 iwad so much more compared to Doom 2 over the course of my life. I might not like Doom 2's city levels, but man, if I could select Doom 2's episodes on a game start that would've been a game changer. Not kidding. I can't even explain why it's such a big deal for me.

 

I did some digging for a level select mod for doom 2 and all I could find was a screenshot from a post where someone said they made their own and never posted it... I guess it's easy enough to do it yourself, just idclev to the first level of the episode you want to play and stop when you hit the intermission screen. episodes are more or less just pistol starting from a specific map and going till another different specific map, anyway. 

 

as to the (very long running) topic at hand, my opinion's fairly standard. doom 1's better vanilla and doom 2 has better mods. 

[TheMightyWhoosh]

Doom has an atmosphere that isn’t really felt in Doom II.

[Maximum Matt]

Doom II.

Because necrobump

[Lucius Wooding]

This thread will still be poppin when Doom 10 comes out.

[openroadracer]

I have to say that I favor DooM II purely because of the expanded enemy roster.

 

See, that's the problem with DooM '93 in all of its variations: any time they want to hit you with a high-tier but non-boss enemy, you just get a bunch of Barons. This creates some pretty bullet-spongy, sloggy gameplay that tests the player's patience and ability to manage resources.

 

On the other hand, DooM II comes in with its expanded roster, which includes numerous different high-tier demons that don't have as much health as the Baron, but make up for it with increased firepower: the Arachnotron's constant plasma fire, the Mancubus scatter-firing fireballs, the Archvile's hitscan attack and ability to revive monsters. Even the Hell Knight has a place, being basically a Baron with half health so it's not as much of a slog to get through him.

 

D2 isn't quite as well balanced, due to this, but it actually works out better in the end, IMO.

[WhateverComic07]

As a standalone game? Doom 1 easy.

 

For Modding and custom wads? Doom 2 Easy

[daydreamer]

6 hours ago, openroadracer said:

I have to say that I favor DooM II purely because of the expanded enemy roster.

 

See, that's the problem with DooM '93 in all of its variations: any time they want to hit you with a high-tier but non-boss enemy, you just get a bunch of Barons. This creates some pretty bullet-spongy, sloggy gameplay that tests the player's patience and ability to manage resources.

 

On the other hand, DooM II comes in with its expanded roster, which includes numerous different high-tier demons that don't have as much health as the Baron, but make up for it with increased firepower: the Arachnotron's constant plasma fire, the Mancubus scatter-firing fireballs, the Archvile's hitscan attack and ability to revive monsters. Even the Hell Knight has a place, being basically a Baron with half health so it's not as much of a slog to get through him.

 

D2 isn't quite as well balanced, due to this, but it actually works out better in the end, IMO.

I agree, the amount of Barons in Doom becomes a bit too much at the end, some variety in monsters would have been better (maybe PSX version fixed this? Haven’t tried it yet)

 

But overall, I’m finding I’m more likely to think “I wish Doom had more monster variety” than “I wish Doom II had better maps”. The atmosphere and level design/flow is just better in Doom which is why it gets my vote.

[xScavengerWolfx]

That's a hard question to answer. I mean if we're talking from game play stand point, Doom 2 since as John Romero once said "Doom 2 is just a bigger badder version of Doom" since they added new enemies, a super shot gun and a few other things. I mean doom 2 spawned a lot of community mega wads as well as a thriving modding scene as well....but i hate to say it but i don't care for doom 2 anymore since playing community based megawad a lot, it feels like too much of a power fantasy and yes i get it "it's supposed to be like that scrub", more power to you if you like running around blasting the BFG and killing hordes of enemies while D_Running is playing. 

 

Now Doom 1 on the other hand is fun because i love the feeling of hopelessness and have to figure out how to fight enemies with limited ammo, health and armor. I mean sure we can argue how Doom 1 is weaker then Doom 2 or Doom 2 level design is far more better then doom 1 (i will talk about that later in this post), but over all for me as far as gameplay wise i like both but i'm more of a sucker for Doom 1 then Doom 2.

 

Now as a mapper stand point: I have to say Doom 1. Only because ever since i've been doing doom 1 mapping thanks to Snax's Ultimate Doom wad she did, i have a much more understanding of how to use limited enemy, health, ammo and other things. I used to do Doom 2 mapping but i have to be honest, it's kinda boring when you have so many enemies you can use, over power weapons and area's where your basically Rambo, i just like using the limited stuff to make maps and make mapping for doom 1 much more fun and become more creative with mapping. Again i get it, not everyone can do doom 1 mapping because "there's no super shot gun in it there for mapping for Doom 1 is lame". Ok but everyone is different, not going to make you change your mind about it but that's just me.

TL;DR: Gameplay wise Doom 2. Mapping wise Doom 1