"New year, new URE" - URE:E2 - E2M2 up!

[Zylinderkatze]

Just one lone screenshot..

 

..wandering aimlessly into this thread.

 

^{It's a connecting passage of sorts!}

 

The fake walls used to be "thicker".. but then you wouldn't be able to see the skybox.

 

I think instead I might just widen the cutouts?

 

The jury is still out.

 

They should really be back by now. Hm.

[Zylinderkatze]

More pictures? Coming right up!

 

Adjacent to that passage from before (actually, just behind the position I took that screenshot from) is this room:

 

^{Light and dark. That's the trick!}

 

It's not new. I posted a screenshot of it before, long, long looooooong.. SO long ago. But now it's finally time to integrate it into the map!

 

Also, what is new, is this angle of the area!

 

^{More light gradients? fancy!}

 

It's a walk up & transition into a different map theme (which then loops back into the passage from the last post, only at a higher level). 

 

I have a good feeling about this!

 

But sleep is nice, too.. so I will go do that for now.

Edited April 11, 2023 by Zylinderkatze

[Zylinderkatze]

And one last "WIP" for the road.

 

To bed.

 

Because that's where I'm going.

 

Also there's no road.

 

I need to work on my analogies.

 

^{No walkies? :c}

 

That is the elevated other side where you come out when you go towards the back and up the stairs in the second screenshot of my previous post.

 

Clearly very much in progress. Not just because it's dark.

 

Actually mainly not because of that.

 

More so because of the transitions / blending between the different ceiling textures / flats.

 

Because there are none.

 

That's something for tomorrow's ZK!

 

Goodnight!

[Zylinderkatze]

I was streaming!

 

And now I am not anymore.

 

<End of initial useless information>

 

Here's a screenshot of the slightly more fleshed out area at the end of the first part of the passage (this probably doesn't make much sense)

 

^{Remember how I said it was missing transitions? Not anymore!}

 

I had to remove a few detailing sectors for different light levels and such, because this time, the Visplanes were starting to act up.

 

But it still looks good! 

^{I think.}

 

 

Bouns round!

 

As a bonus, a look down the above-mentioned "passage", looking towards the (now detailed) raised area.

 

^{This is from last night, when the detailing wasn't done yet.}

 

The detailing still isn't really done but I am moving on from here because I'd rather come back later with a more concise theme instead of detailing stuff now just to.. detail stuff.

 

Changed in the map, compared to that last screenshot: the wall in the very back is now the "BROWNPIP" texture. 

 

This, though, is one of the things I am not 100% sure about whether I'll keep it because this area already has all that grey and dark brown.. adding the light brown / beige from the pipe texture.. doesn't feel necessary?

 

Here's what I mean:

 

^{This is the view from inside the area from this post.}

 

That BROWNPIP you see beyond the little archway thing.. yeah. I'm not sure if I'll keep it there. 

 

It's all a kind of odd little "splash of pipage".. that basically only exists on that dividing wall with the archway. And because that kind of felt "not enough", I also continued it on the wall beyond.

 

I'm sure it'll make sense eventually xD

Edited April 13, 2023 by Zylinderkatze

["JL" was too short]

On 4/11/2023 at 5:51 PM, Zylinderkatze said:

 

The deployment of GRAY textures in this, and to a lesser extent the middle screenshot of your most recent post, put me in mind of the testing labs from Portal.  Not a criticism, or an endorsement for that matter; just thought it was interesting how quickly that association popped to mind.

[Zylinderkatze]

9 hours ago, jerrysheppy said:

mind

This was a triumph!

 

Hmm. Portal, your say? I'll take it!

 

Maybe I'll model out a very suspicious looking cube somewhere off to a side behind some blocked opening xD

 

I wasn't at all thinking of Portal while mapping this area but I get it! Not the worst mood to convey.

 

Now let's see what happens, after you threw that grain of sand into the machinery of my mind xD

[Zylinderkatze]

Captain, we've reached critical mess!

 

It happened. Yesterday after posting my last post, I was ready to go to bed.. then I looked at a little bit of map here, adjusted a little there, added a section here, detailed a room there..

 

..and then it was almost 4am ^^;

 

I'm not sure what this means. I'll probably find out today!

[Zylinderkatze]

URE:E2M4 > Fun with pipes!

 

I think I found a "reason" for the pipe-related textures in this part of the map. There is water in this area after all.

 

^{Not in this picture: water.}

 

This is basically the backroom, behind the wall (and a little below).

 

I am once again using one of those seemingly under-utilized textures (BROWNWEL).. which oftentimes serves as a switch / interactive element of sorts, when it's present in my maps. Usually not as a necessary one, though.

 

In this map, it so far doesn't do anything at all yet.. since I just put it there xD

 

The console in front doesn't do anything either, before you ask.

 

But I'll keep this place updated!

 

Stay tuned.

[Zylinderkatze]

The updates just keep on coming!

 

Here's another screenshot, as I work my way towards the exit:

 

^{Experimenting with different ceiling textures (flats)}

 

I'm "gradient-ing" from 210 light level to 160, which isn't really that many visible steps.. so I am trying different flats. Flats with more "structure" can help distract from those light level sector lines. Not sure if this grey one is the best choice but it actually looks kinda nice with the brown.

 

I'll definitely keep that in mind, even if I might not keep it for this section.

 

Also, that "POISON" sign currently is a lift "trap" (albeit with a reward) which I haven't modeled out yet because I am not sure whether I'll actually keep it ^^;

 

I just wanted an outcrop there.

 

Look at it while it's still there :D

[Zylinderkatze]

Break time!

 

I stayed up too late last night so tonight I'm taking it easy.

 

One last comparison: Remember the "what's in progress" automap view? It was in this post.

 

Basically, this is the change so far:

 

 > 

 

Do with this information what you will!

 

Goodnight :)

Edited April 18, 2023 by Zylinderkatze

["JL" was too short]

On 4/14/2023 at 3:18 AM, Zylinderkatze said:

This was a triumph!

🎵🎶
I'm making a post here:
Huge success
It's hard to overstate
My satisfaction

Zyl-in-der-kat-ze
He does what he must

Because he can

Re-making his classic WADs
(Except the ones that are lost)
But there's no sense crying
Over every lost file
You just place some new linedefs

And perhaps an Arch-Vile
And you sketch out some crap
And you make a neat map
For the Doomers who are

Still alive 🎵🎶


Edit: I just realized I assumed your pronouns with this post which, statistically speaking, is probably the right assumption but I don't think I actually know for certain. XD

Edited April 15, 2023 by jerrysheppy

[Zylinderkatze]

15 hours ago, jerrysheppy said:

Edit

 

Very much appreciated! I am.. statistically male xD

 

I'm fine with just about anything, as long as I know you mean me - but it's cool that you're considerate like that!

He/Him, They/Them, Zylinder/Katze.. all work. Or think of your own!

 

Also, that was a lovely interpretation of Coulton's song's lyrics.

 

Pleasant all around. Even more reason to put a cube in there!

[Zylinderkatze]

HEUREKA!

 

No wait.. it's not that exceptional..

 

 

^HEUREKA.

 

There.

 

I managed to get a door in, where I always wanted to be a door.

 

Don't look at me like that. Let me explain.

 

See this?

 

^{There, at the end of the sidewalk / pavement. Tht used to only be a wall.}

 

Logically, that didn't make sense to me, because why would the walkway go there and then end in a wall?

 

However, the DrawSegs had a different idea:

 

^{That spot down there used to go over 256 whenever I tried for a door.}

 

But! That above heatmap is already the heat with the door! I downgraded a bit of detail here and there (less than I thought I'd have to) and voilà: door.

 

And all this without sacrificing any of the other details in that spot, like the fake continued upper building..

 

^{Admittedly, it's kind of more shallow than it should be.}

 

..or this open window in the wall opposite wall:

 

^{With a Sergeant, no less!}

 

I know it's not an amazing breakthrough.. but it made me happy :D

 

And there's even stuff behind the door!

 

Well- not really, yet. but going to be!

 

Whee!

Edited April 18, 2023 by Zylinderkatze

["JL" was too short]

20 minutes ago, Zylinderkatze said:

I'm fine with just about anything, as long as I know you mean me - but it's cool that you're considerate like that!

He/Him, They/Them, Zylinder/Katze.. all work. Or think of your own!

Funnily enough, if I were going solely off your username then I should have gendered you feminine, technically speaking. XD

[Zylinderkatze]

It's thing'in time!

 

Come on, thing along!

 

^{Just putting some stuff here and there.}

 

Also did some detailing and added some secret stuff.. and found a few joined sectors that became.. unjoined, somehow (maybe I moved some sectors but I don't remember doing that).. either way, that broke a few interactive events.. which are now working again!

 

Crisis averted.

 

Now it's time for bed.

[Zylinderkatze]

5 hours ago, jerrysheppy said:

username

 

Very attentive!

 

Yes, there's a whole story behind it.. hidden somewhere in one of my post, on one of my threads ^^;

 

Katze is the female cat. Kater would be male (for those wondering what @jerrysheppy is on about).. but with the attached story as well as the tendency of most Germans I know to call any feline a "Katze", I resolved to be okay with it.

 

Also, I think "Katze" just sounds better. Not sure where that bias comes from though.

 

Also also, see Fig. A: 

6 hours ago, Zylinderkatze said:

I'm fine with just about anything, as long as I know you mean me

 

 

Also, also.. also: I might've ended up mapping some more.. I really have a problem.

 

Good thing it's the weekend.

 

But it's also 3am.. so.. off I go!

[Zylinderkatze]

20 hours ago, Zylinderkatze said:

Crisis averted.

 

Actually not quite.. because when I realized that some joined sectors had come undone in E2M4, I chacked E2M3 as well and.. err..

 

Yeah. Looks like I have some work to do!

 

Maybe not today anymore though. Eary day tomorrow.

 

Take care, all!

[Zylinderkatze]

13 hours ago, Zylinderkatze said:

some work

 

The problem was, that I moved the sectors of both E2M3 and E2M4 so that the spot of both maps that overlaps is in the same location (X / Y of the grid view). 

 

I thought (without reason), that joined sectors would remain joined when you move them all together.. but I was either wrong about that.. or it was too much / too many sectors moved at once for UDB.. or I have some setting set to the wrong value in UDM, perhaps.

 

Probably just me wrongly assuming that it would work and it doesn't / never did. Yay me! :D

 

So now I have to re-join a bunch of helper sectors that I used to enable the whole "water level adjustment" in the level with the ship lock (E2M3). Thankfully, I still have backups from before the moving of those sectors, so I can look back in those cases where it's not obvious.

 

No further updates today (most likely) because it's my mom's birthday and I'll be busy all day being a good son.

 

Acting! *jazz hands*

[zokum]

The reason the visplane goes sky-high in that area is the curvy sector in the middle. Every corner that has an angle above 180" will create another sub sector. With two-sided linedefs, that means anything but a straight line with two linedefs will create a sub sector. You might get away with a better split model if you placed some strategic double sided linedefs in order to hint to the nodebuilder where to partition. I've done tests on that, and it worked. Whether it will work here, I don't know. It's not a well know trick, but it should be worth trying.

[Zylinderkatze]

4 hours ago, zokum said:

It's not a well know trick

I'll definitely try that later today!

 

Thanks! :D

[Zylinderkatze]

Hey y'all!

 

Scott ZK here.

 

So last night and today I mainly adjusted some floor- and ceiling heights as well as texture offsets by single units until it felt good to me.

 

As a result, though, I don't have much to show because it's in an area that's not very spectacular.

 

But just so you have something to look at.. here's one of the rooms from that area!

 

^{Dude there's a hole in your ceiling.}

 

This room will likely stay like this for now. No enemies yet- no mean "stuff opening behind your back".. uhh.. yet.

 

Should be lotsa fun when itsa done!

 

Okay I'll see myself out.

[Zylinderkatze]

Bedtime.

 

I'm not gone yet! Can't get rid of me that easy. Easily. Easilily.

 

 

I meant to post this sooner but then I didn't want to do the work of making a GIF. Also, I kind of forgot. Until now. Of course. When it's actually time to sleep.

 

So this is what I "believe to understand" @zokum meant with how curves cause a whole bunch of sub sectors. Node-building, Binary Space Partitioning tables, other relevant terms.

 

So anyways.. here's a little animation!

 

Fancy!

 

This goes from map (sector) view, to nodes view, then back to the sector view with an overlay of "highlighting some of the extra nodes that are added specifically in relation to the curves". For emphasis.

 

The animation then stops on the last view, to be less visually distracting. So if it doesn't seem to move, you missed it!

 

I realized too late that I should've also overlaid the Visplane > Drawsegs view to drive home the point of how the "heat" is directly related to those extra sub sectors.

 

But you get the point anyways. I hope.

 

I may make a revised animation at some point (soon?) with the Drawsegs view added.

 

But don't hold your breath.

 

I mean.. unless you can hold your breath for about 20 hours :D

 

But you still probably shouldn't do that.

 

Goodnight!

 

["JL" was too short]

21 minutes ago, Zylinderkatze said:

The animation then stops on the last view, to be less visually distracting. So if it doesn't seem to move, you missed it!

 

Nice animation.  I would have made it loop, though.  I don't think it would be too distracting and it would be easier to see.

[Zylinderkatze]

10 hours ago, jerrysheppy said:

Nice animation.  I would have made it loop, though.  I don't think it would be too distracting and it would be easier to see.

 

I should've added that you can "right-click & open in new window" on the image to see it again.. but yeah you're right! 

 

Next time (maybe for the updated version already) I'll just make it loop and put it in a "spoiler"-box instead, so people can watch it whenever they want and for as long as they want :)

Edited April 19, 2023 by Zylinderkatze

[Andromeda]

On 4/4/2023 at 8:27 PM, Zylinderkatze said:

Afterthought:

 

I am currently considering making use of an item that I could use to tease the player from E2M2.. that they could see but not reach from E2M2.. and only get to in the E2M4 version of the same area (but then they might wonder why they can't get to it >_<).

 

It would clearly have to be an item that doesn't count towards the 100% item pickup. like maybe a Berzerk or a Backpack.

 

Also, I would be breaking with my "if you can see it, you can get to it" self-imposed rule.

 

This is getting too "concept-y", I think >_<

Bit late, but the berserk counts towards the item count.

[zokum]

It should be noted that if the additional sub sectors are small, there's a good chance that they can merge into the same vis planes. There will however often be angles where no merges are possible, and that's often where the visplane overflows happen.

Using the same properties for sectors help. Same height, light level, texture. Sky texture is a special case where height and light levels are ignored as far as I can remember. If this is an outside area, you could perhaps get away with raising the central ceiling up to avoid it being rendered. I haven't experimented much into this, but in software doom there should be no artifacts when using such tricks.

[Zylinderkatze]

1 hour ago, Andromeda said:

Bit late, but the berserk counts towards the item count.

So it does! oh no. Okay and here I was sure it didn't.. thanks!

 

I kind of decided against teasing an item by now, anyways, I feel too guilty about some players maybe thinking they can get to it.

 

But I'll remember this now!

 

Thanks again :)

["JL" was too short]

Perhaps you could put a ranged enemy there instead to snipe at the player, and then in the subsequent map, place a "dead [enemy]" decoration there from when the player killed it.  Obviously you'd need it to be an enemy that has such a corpse decoration, so no Barons of Hell, I don't think.

And if the player didn't kill it in e2m2, well, these demons do fight each other to the death sometimes, so it still makes sense.

pre-post edit: could even be, like, one or more shotgun guys, and then you could place shotguns with the corpses in e2m4.  I think there's a dead shotgunner thing?

actual edit: Yeah, that'd be a really good way to actually give the player some pickups out of it without feeling in e2m2 like there must be a way to get to the item.  I'm pretty sure most players are used to the idea that they won't necessarily be able nor expected to pick up every weapon/ammo drop from a former human that gets emplaced on a ledge or in a cage.

Edited April 19, 2023 by jerrysheppy

[Zylinderkatze]

13 hours ago, jerrysheppy said:

I think there's a dead shotgunner thing?

 

There is, yes :D Former human AND former sergeant both exist as decoration.

 

However, with my maps you can always somehow get to the enemies that drop pickups (I think without exception). Even if that's not really a DOOM mapping / PWAD "law", I always strive to make it possible. If somehow not possible, I put a non-pickup-dropping enemy instead xD

 

I think I'll just make them visually connect, only. Probably without any item pickup hinting or teasing. Maybe I will actually lean on that dead enemies idea, though.. I'll keep this place updated as it happens ^^

[Zylinderkatze]

17 hours ago, Zylinderkatze said:

But I'll remember this now!

 

I'll even 1-up myself and make a list for myself (and anyone curious), to come back to (taken from https://doomwiki.org/wiki/Item)

 

I give you: Items that don't count towards "100% items"!

• Stimpack
• Medikit
• Armor (NOT Armor bonus!)
• Megaarmor
• Backpack
• Radiation Suit
• Ammo
• Keys
• Weapons

 

Maybe the secret area will be a health bay. It's close to the Reactor, after all (E2M2) so it having Rad Suits would even make sense, too.

Edited April 20, 2023 by Zylinderkatze