Plutonia Revisited: Community Project 2 (Boom-compatible)- Final Version Released! **IDGAMES LINK UP**

[riderr3]

On 2/26/2021 at 12:29 AM, Omniarch said:

So, in essence, what is it that makes a map 'Plutonic'?

 

The fact of the matter is that, as noted earlier by other participants, it will not work to make a map in the spirit of Plutonia just using "connected corridors" and "lots of chaingunners".

Since the original Plutonia was created by only two mappers, it is pretty samey in many ways, unlike TNT Evilution made by a motley team. It is a set of aggregates that, under certain circumstances, form that very feeling.

Edited February 28, 2021 by riderr3

[Omniarch]

1 minute ago, riderr3 said:

The fact of the matter is that, as noted earlier by other participants, it will not work to make a map in the spirit of Plutonia only using "connected corridors" and "lots of chaingunners".

That is precisely why I asked the question to begin with. My style of mapping tends to focus on free-wheeling, dynamic combat with an emphasis on quick decision-making and constant movement. I'm not sure such an approach is compatible with Plutonia, which seems, in general, to prefer entrenched enemies over free-roaming ones, and has a greater focus on traps and isolated encounters rather than incidental or dynamic combat.

 

My question basically boils down to this: is dynamic, open style combat (comparable to what you'd see in a skillsaw or cannonball map) compatible with the spirit of Plutonia?

[Hitboi]

Didn't get feedback from Discord testers on my semi-last version, I just need some feedback and my map is done.

PRCP-HitBoi.wad

Map name: The Nightmare After Christmas
Map slot: 08
Music: "Jade Empire" (by stewboy, from the Plutonia MIDI Pack)

Screenshots:

Spoiler

Note: these images are from an old version.

 

[NeedHealth]

On 2/25/2021 at 10:29 PM, Omniarch said:

This may sound a bit... daft, but I'm not really sure what makes a map 'Plutonic'.

A couple rooms and a few difficult rooms with traps. No more than 10 minutes of gameplay.

[Joshy]

9 hours ago, Omniarch said:

That is precisely why I asked the question to begin with. My style of mapping tends to focus on free-wheeling, dynamic combat with an emphasis on quick decision-making and constant movement. I'm not sure such an approach is compatible with Plutonia, which seems, in general, to prefer entrenched enemies over free-roaming ones, and has a greater focus on traps and isolated encounters rather than incidental or dynamic combat.

 

My question basically boils down to this: is dynamic, open style combat (comparable to what you'd see in a skillsaw or cannonball map) compatible with the spirit of Plutonia?

It has been discussed a few times on discord on what makes a map Plutonia-like. Here are some of my answers regarding gameplay:

• for me, it's forcing players to move around quickly and improvise, every monster plays a part and has an impact mainly because of their placement or timing of placement
• it's essentially efficient high impact gameplay
• yeah definitely not constantly (moving around non-stop), i think a good way of describing it is that it's like a story, there's always a kind of flow happening, a moment of madness followed by brief exploration and then another frenzy
• some has commented on sunlust being plutonia on steroids which makes sense, it's not quite like plutonia but the execution and goal is very similar

So yes, what you've mentioned is definitely compatible with the spirit of Plutonia since the gameplay you describe is generally high impact and shortish (with the exception of a few long maps).

[DJVCardMaster]

For me a "Plutonic" style map would be:

Aesthetics:
-Rocky/jungle/natural-like
-Symmetrical shapes
-Tech-things on a minor scale mostly mixed with the natural style mentioned before.
-Green, brown and red
-High usage of the Plutonia-brick textures
-Cages
-Crypt landscapes and "tomb-raiding" feeling

Gameplay:
-Fast paced action (Rushing from safe spot to safe spot through hard sections)
-Effective monster placement
-Combinations of monsters with a central focus on both chaingunners and revenants
-Unfair traps
-Short/medium sized maps
-No monster spamming/slaughtermaps
-Enemy snipers
-Arch-viles leading revenant armies
-Teleporting enemies blocking your exits when trying to progress

Plutonium Winds is this taken to the extreme, often feeling like a Skillsaw map, with Plutonia looks, so you can take some inspiration, but my best bet would be to take note from Plutonia 2 which captures the feel of it in a balanced way. For this project combining both ideas would be great, and I did for my map Waters in some way.

[Silhouette 03]

@AvadaKedavraWithQuadDamage, you asked for a tester, and you shall receive. Played on UV.

 

Gameplay

The map, in many aspects, seems to take a lot of inspiration from the earlier plutonia maps in how it treats it's gameplay. Short maps, high difficulty. However, your map seems to deviate slightly, mostly for the better. For instance, you're very nice to pistol-starters( If I recall correctly, many of Plutonia's early maps weren't exactly nice to pistol starters, such as map05). You also seem to curb your inner mean streak by giving the player some advantage over the opposition, such as the invisibility sphere in the teleport area with the hit-scanners on either side, or giving access to stronger armaments from the get go, not having the player scavenge for better weaponry. I'd argue that the scavenging aspect of the combat should be there to some capacity, as it heightens tension and the difficulty slightly ,though that's your call. Some of the traps could be buffed here and there, such as the pain elemental trap with the SSG could have a bit more to it, as simply standing in front of her and firing the SSG would stop her from projectile launching her children( that's a new sentence) at you and making the fight trivial.

 

Layout

Following the trend of the aforementioned source material and inspiration, the map's layout is relatively simple and mostly linear, though it doesn't feel flat or needlessly barren. I'd argue that the maps overall simplicity lends itself nicely to flow, though that's a subjective view.

 

Texturing and detailing

 I honestly wasn't sure what to think of the visual aesthetic you created from the screenshots, but I have to say it is a nice change of pace. The snowy jungle(tundra?) you created is certainly unique and I took a moment here and there to admire the texture work and the fascinating way you seem to bring the two themes together without making it feel forced together or incoherent.

 

Bugs

None that I noticed, but I'd like to bring an issue with one secret to light. The secret with the box of rockets in the area you accessed with the red key, has too many torches blocking the one box of rockets from being picked up.

 

https://imgur.com/a/Syq2Y7a

 

Conclusion

A map that wants to do something different in the visuals department, yet needs a bit of tweaking in the gameplay and the traps. Can't wait to play the finished version when the project releases.

 

I hope this feedback was actually useful and I didn't waste your time repeating information that other testers have given. Was a pleasure testing your map!

 

 

 

 

[cannonball]

Update to Oceania

 

OceaniaV2.zip

 

Most of the changes at this stage are more to do with visuals. I also adjusted some of the texture alignment to fit with the texture pack.

Edited March 4, 2021 by cannonball

[sincity2100]

My map, Hate Machine

 

https://www.mediafire.com/file/3xxon6j6nny1l8y/Hate_Machine.wad/file

 

You will find it in map 12.

[Joshy]

8 hours ago, sincity2100 said:

My map, Hate Machine

 

https://www.mediafire.com/file/3xxon6j6nny1l8y/Hate_Machine.wad/file

 

You will find it in map 12.

Just played it, not a bad map. The one issue is the health/ammo balance particularly around the red skull key room/cyberdemon room. As it is, I had to use the BFG secret room for it to be remotely playable. Without the secret, there just isn't enough ammo/health to play through that section which can get vicious with the amount of revenants and hitscanners.

[CyberHog]

Hello, signed up on the board just for this.

Been wanting to get back to Doom mapping for quite a while and this gave me some motivation.

 

Any particular map editor you guys recommend?

I have used Doom Builder previously but considering it was 7-8 years ago I last made a map there are probably newer and better editors out there now.

 

Regards

CyberHog

[MFG38]

4 hours ago, CyberHog said:

Any particular map editor you guys recommend?

I have used Doom Builder previously but considering it was 7-8 years ago I last made a map there are probably newer and better editors out there now.

 

Ultimate Doom Builder, or if your rig can't run that, Doom Builder X.

Edited March 5, 2021 by MFG38

[CyberHog]

8 minutes ago, MFG38 said:

 

Ultimate Doom Builder, or if your rig can't run that, Doom Builder X.

 

Thanks, already started a bit but could easily open the file in Ultimate Doom Builder instead.

 

Look forward to see what everyone contribute with to this project.

[sincity2100]

15 hours ago, Joshy said:

Just played it, not a bad map. The one issue is the health/ammo balance particularly around the red skull key room/cyberdemon room. As it is, I had to use the BFG secret room for it to be remotely playable. Without the secret, there just isn't enough ammo/health to play through that section which can get vicious with the amount of revenants and hitscanners.

Can you suggest where can I put my ammo and health so it can be balanced, I think that's my problem, I make secrets more demanding for people to finish the map sometimes.

[sincity2100]

https://www.mediafire.com/file/jgnen63nt5rduyi/Hate_Machine%282%29.wad/file

 

Here's a second verison of the Hate Machine, I added few advantages and changed some details

[CyberHog]

Down There.rar

 

Here is the first version of my map. "Down There..."

Map spot 01 for testing, don't really care which one it will be later but since there are some Hellish-areas episode 2 would probably be suitable.

 

Screenshots:

 

 

What makes Plutonia so great compared to the other iwads imo is how a lot of levels are very non-linear, with convoluted nature-esque architecture. I tried for something similiar. So a huge cave that spreads into several areas here.

 

119 enemies on Ultraviolence

4 secrets

 

This is my first published map ever so feedback is more than welcome. Hopefully it can be used for this.

 

EDIT: I used the texture pack attatched to the OP, so it needs to be loaded at the same time as that.
Oh and Plutonia as iwad of course.

Edited March 11, 2021 by CyberHog

[DukeOfDoom]

Finally finished my map. It was originally supposed to be for Final Doom the Way ID Did, but after the project itself got on hiatus, I eventually revamped the map and added several new locations.

 

Name: Acid Bath

Slot: MAP19

Music: Standard (might be changed later on)

Multiplayer: Yes

 

 

acid_bath.rar

Edited March 15, 2021 by DukeOfDoom

[CyberHog]

On 3/11/2021 at 6:15 PM, CyberHog said:

Down There.rar

 

Here is the first version of my map. "Down There..."

Map spot 01 for testing, don't really care which one it will be later but since there are some Hellish-areas episode 2 would probably be suitable.

 

Screenshots:

 

 

What makes Plutonia so great compared to the other iwads imo is how a lot of levels are very non-linear, with convoluted nature-esque architecture. I tried for something similiar. So a huge cave that spreads into several areas here.

 

119 enemies on Ultraviolence

4 secrets

 

This is my first published map ever so feedback is more than welcome. Hopefully it can be used for this.

 

EDIT: I used the texture pack attatched to the OP, so it needs to be loaded at the same time as that.
Oh and Plutonia as iwad of course.

 

Down There.rar

 

Updated version, primarily some cosmetic changes, also added multiplayer starts and a few extra enemies/pickups for coop.

Thanks to @Silhou3tte for testing it.

 

Map spot does not really matter, but if there is a level that starts in a bloody/Hellish area this would be fitting to come before it.

 

[cannonball]

Here is another map (Well technically now the first map). This map has a long history in the sense that the general layout sat on my computer for a couple of years before finally detailing and adding monsters to suit a plutonia/hellish theme.

Verdant Keep

It will probably suit an early E2 slot if it is good enough. Difficulty settings added along with co-op starts.

 

Verdantkeepv2.zip

Edited March 14, 2021 by cannonball

[Omniarch]

42 minutes ago, cannonball said:

Verdant Keep

 

I found a bug: thing 274 is stuck inside thing 40. Was 274 supposed to only appear on lower difficulties?

 

That aside, I had a good time with this map. The combat and detailing were both on point, as per the norm. The layout is fantastic, easy to navigate and quite vertical, very Hadron-esque. Actually, this one feels a lot like RtH E2-3. Is it a reject from one of those perchance?

[cannonball]

18 minutes ago, Omniarch said:

 

I found a bug: thing 274 is stuck inside thing 40. Was 274 supposed to only appear on lower difficulties?

 

That aside, I had a good time with this map. The combat and detailing were both on point, as per the norm. The layout is fantastic, easy to navigate and quite vertical, very Hadron-esque. Actually, this one feels a lot like RtH E2-3. Is it a reject from one of those perchance?

 

Yep, this was a goof on my part. The HK was for HNTR only, I have fixed this and re-uploaded the file in the above post.

In this case the map was part of a couple of solo doom2 ideas that were either scrapped or were halted before a hell episode was reached in terms of development.

Edited March 14, 2021 by cannonball

[DukeOfDoom]

I wouldn't mind some criticism towards Acid Bath. I just wish to know what I did right, what I did wrong and how should I improve it.

It's also best for me to pick a music piece for that one.

@cannonball Your map looks pretty cool, gotta try it soon.

 

 

Edited March 14, 2021 by DukeOfDoom

[Omniarch]

46 minutes ago, DukeOfDoom said:

I wouldn't mind some criticism towards Acid Bath. I just wish to know what I did right, what I did wrong and how should I improve it.

 

I just finished a UV run of the map. I got 100% secrets and 97% kills, and played using PrBoom+

 

In short, I think Acid Bath is a great Plutonia map (one could even say it is the 'Plutonic' ideal, eh? eh?), that embodies pretty much all the design principles that define that half of Final Doom in my eyes.

 

1) it starts out immensely difficult, with an extreme degree of player exposure and overwhelming opposition, but gradually eases up as the player gains a foothold and whittles down the numerous snipers one by one.

 

2) the map punishes both cowardice and reckless aggression, forcing the player to maintain acute awareness of their surroundings.

 

3) foreknowledge of traps and enemy placement is critical to success. The map is not geared towards being beaten on first attempt, though this is of course still entirely possible. Level knowledge is highly important.

 

4) each monster makes its presence felt. Enemies are placed with great precision and care, making the map's relatively small host a lethal, well-entrenched force. Bonus points for downright malicious AV placement.

 

5) the map is split between the main, outdoor area which is very open and non-linear, and a series of side rooms, each of which contains it's own encounter.

 

6) the traps are brutal. The plasma room in particular is downright evil, very Casali-esque. I was almost ready to call BS until I realized I could escape without killing the AV.

 

7) the geometry feels very much like the original Plutonia, generally semi-orthogonal but with all the edges smoothed out. There is also a significant degree of verticality to the layout, which is also very Plutonic.

 

8) the level also looks authentically Plutonic, bearing a strong resemblance to many of the 'grunge' style techbases found in the original, as well as its unofficial successors.

 

Other aspects of the map, such as resource balancing, progression and secrets, are all solid, no complaints here. The visuals are also on point, both in terms of lighting and texturing. There really just isn't anything noticeably wrong here from my perspective. I did however notice a couple of bugs:

 

1) thing 269 (nice) is stuck inside 268 (erm...), which I presume is the result of mistagging for difficulty.

 

2) the AVs standing on sectors 160-62 can easily be pushed off by Plasma fire, making them impossible to kill (hence my 97%). I'd recommend setting the surrounding linedefs to impassable, or at least monster-blocking.

 

In summary, Acid Bath is an excellent Plutonic map, a true embodiment of the style as far as I can tell.

 

(I'm also up for some Deathmatch/CooP playtesting at some point if you're interested)

[DukeOfDoom]

@Omniarch

 

Thanks for your criticism! :) 

 

I have updated my map, make sure to check it out!

[Hitboi]

Finally finished Map08! Changes are based on @Silhou3tte's feedback, thanks Silhou3tte!
PRCP2-HitBoi.wad

Edited March 17, 2021 by AvadaKedavraWithQuadDamage

[MFG38]

Figured I should finally take the time to write up this little post to explain why I failed to live up to my promise of having a map submitted by the end of last month, in case @Joshy or anyone else was wondering what's taking me so long.

 

Truthfully, the more I worked on the map, the more unsure I was becoming about what I wanted to do with it. I managed to get half a layout done and was decently happy with it, but at the same time, something about it felt... off. Not particularly Plutonia-esque, if you will (though I do realize that there's a lot more to a Plutonia-style map than its layout). Last time I thought about trying to work on it again, it'd been two weeks since I laid down the most recent pieces of it, and I was getting no decent ideas whatsoever as to how I should expand it. So I ended up deleting the entire WAD file the other day.

 

So yeah. Chances are I won't contribute a map to this project (either) after all. Though to be fair, I did sort of attach myself to this project on a whim without a clear idea of what sort of map I wanted to make or if it'd be fitting for the project in the first place. So this project is probably best off without it anyway.

 

Thank you and sorry.

[Joshy]

17 hours ago, MFG38 said:

Figured I should finally take the time to write up this little post to explain why I failed to live up to my promise of having a map submitted by the end of last month, in case @Joshy or anyone else was wondering what's taking me so long.

 

Truthfully, the more I worked on the map, the more unsure I was becoming about what I wanted to do with it. I managed to get half a layout done and was decently happy with it, but at the same time, something about it felt... off. Not particularly Plutonia-esque, if you will (though I do realize that there's a lot more to a Plutonia-style map than its layout). Last time I thought about trying to work on it again, it'd been two weeks since I laid down the most recent pieces of it, and I was getting no decent ideas whatsoever as to how I should expand it. So I ended up deleting the entire WAD file the other day.

 

So yeah. Chances are I won't contribute a map to this project (either) after all. Though to be fair, I did sort of attach myself to this project on a whim without a clear idea of what sort of map I wanted to make or if it'd be fitting for the project in the first place. So this project is probably best off without it anyway.

 

Thank you and sorry.

No worries at all. :) I'd say there's a good chance the map layout is better than you thought it was, this project is to encourage people to have a go at what they think is Plutonia. It doesn't strictly have to be like Plutonia, otherwise it wouldn't be a good community project for people to learn from. But more importantly, you do what feels right for you. Take care of yourself!

[Joshy]

On 3/12/2021 at 4:15 AM, CyberHog said:

Down There.rar

 

Here is the first version of my map. "Down There..."

Map spot 01 for testing, don't really care which one it will be later but since there are some Hellish-areas episode 2 would probably be suitable.

 

What makes Plutonia so great compared to the other iwads imo is how a lot of levels are very non-linear, with convoluted nature-esque architecture. I tried for something similiar. So a huge cave that spreads into several areas here.

 

Your map is not bad for a first map, you've got the basics down pat. You're right that Plutonia has elements of nature-esque architecture and relatively non-linear gameplay at times but this map doesn't quite look or play like a Plutonia level due to several reasons:

• It's very big, spacey, and bare. Plutonia levels are generally compact and tight, (although there are some big ones but the layout design compensates for this). Because it's so big and bare, it doesn't look good, it looks very underdetailed, and gameplay is unchallenging as there's too much space to move around, rendering all threats non-existent.
• Layout doesn't flow or makes sense. The key strength with Plutonia layouts is that they all flow quite well generally which makes it a lot of fun.
• Texturing and architecture is a bit uninteresting and samey, and could do with more variety and trims to break the monotony.

I hope you find the feedback helpful. Let me know if you want any specific feedback or clarification :)

[blob1024]

oh i've missed this untill now. goodluck with progression in this project guys, i'll be looking forward the first releases.

I really like the fast-paced full of action plutonia-like maps

[CyberHog]

11 hours ago, Joshy said:

Your map is not bad for a first map, you've got the basics down pat. You're right that Plutonia has elements of nature-esque architecture and relatively non-linear gameplay at times but this map doesn't quite look or play like a Plutonia level due to several reasons:

• It's very big, spacey, and bare. Plutonia levels are generally compact and tight, (although there are some big ones but the layout design compensates for this). Because it's so big and bare, it doesn't look good, it looks very underdetailed, and gameplay is unchallenging as there's too much space to move around, rendering all threats non-existent.
• Layout doesn't flow or makes sense. The key strength with Plutonia layouts is that they all flow quite well generally which makes it a lot of fun.
• Texturing and architecture is a bit uninteresting and samey, and could do with more variety and trims to break the monotony.

I hope you find the feedback helpful. Let me know if you want any specific feedback or clarification :)

 

I see you quoted my first post here, you did see that I released a second version with more detail?

Not that is is Sunder-level anyway of course...

 

I can definitely make it a bit nicer overall and difficulty is the easiest (and funnest!) thing to change. My biggest inspiration level-wise was Aztec, with dwindling tunnels and cave-ish areas. Does not look or play much like that one at all in the end of course.

 

If the level is too un-Plutonish it's no problem, I can use this map for another project I have in mind as well, but if you think it is salvagable I can fix it as well.

Or just make a completely new level for this one when I have spent more time and gotten better overall.

 

Edited March 21, 2021 by CyberHog